Talk:Ultrametamagical Sorcerer (3.5e Alternate Class Feature)

Metamagic Time
I really like this ACF. I just doubt that many Sorcerers would like spending the extra time making a spell metamagical. The Dire Reverend 23:05, 19 July 2011 (UTC)


 * There's an Alternate Class Feature in the Player's Handbook II that allows a sorcerer to drop a familiar to have regular metamagic casting (as per wizard). Pair that up. Booyah. --Ganteka Future 04:00, 2 August 2012 (UTC)


 * Metamagic Specialist from PHB2 is only a number of times per day though. For the best Sorcerer Metamagic, you need to pick up Rapid Metamagic from Complete Mage, which requires you 12 Ranks in Spellcraft. --Dr Platypus 09:20, 2 August 2012 (UTC)


 * It's just a move action. Go ride a palanquin or something. --Foxwarrior 18:39, 2 August 2012 (UTC)


 * No Enervation capstone? Boo :(. --Aarnott 19:36, 2 August 2012 (UTC)


 * I'm sorry. I could change the spells known list so it gave a new level every 6 instead of every 7, I guess. I haven't actually explored how excessive you can be with this class already though, so it might not be a good idea. --Foxwarrior 19:55, 2 August 2012 (UTC)


 * Maybe I'm not creative enough, but the best abuse I can see is using Heighten Spell, Arcane Thesis, and some +0 metamagic adjusters to make a really high DC spell (say with 3 +0 metamagic adjustments, you can have a "level 16" spell). And +7 DC on Stinking cloud certainly isn't BAD, but this ACF seems too feat-hungry to be Very High level considering the GREATLY reduced versatility. If anything it should also add some bonus metamagic feats. I don't think a 4th level slot as a capstone would be over the top. --Aarnott 20:13, 2 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Edit: I suppose everything can be persisted. Are there any 4th level spells that are over-the-top when persisted? --Aarnott 20:14, 2 August 2012 (UTC)


 * Well, I already made the Save DCs not scale with spell level so Heighten Spell couldn't be abused (and wouldn't be necessary). Persistent scrying? :P
 * Persistent greater invisibility would be worth casting. Persistent fear would be cool.
 * I guess improving the spells known and giving some metamagic feats would be just fine. --Foxwarrior 20:59, 2 August 2012 (UTC)


 * I should learn to read stuff I comment on. Yeah, I don't see issues with having 4th levels and possibly even 5th. --Aarnott 21:04, 2 August 2012 (UTC)


 * Well, let's consider what a level 12 Sorcerer is like at this point. 9 feats, say Widen, Reach, Enlarge, Extend, Persistent, Repeat, Maximize, Silent, and Still, because this Sorcerer just loooves the SRD for some reason. They've only got one level 3 spell: if it was Fireball, they could do, umm, Widened or Maximized Fireballs, Stilled, Silenced and/or Enlarged; that's not very impressive: they don't even get the long outdated Fly Fireball combo yet. Other 3rd level spells don't jump out at me as being more amazingly improved by these metamagics. Being able to still every combat spell could let them wear full plate, I suppose, and they can sort of afford to have Persistent blur, expeditious retreat, disguise self, comprehend languages, and shield, I guess, but items for most of that stuff should be overly cheap by now.
 * Things probably change a bit once you introduce all the Wizard-level Metamagic things in terms of raw power at least. --Foxwarrior 21:42, 2 August 2012 (UTC)