Talk:Arch-Golem Execution Girlfriend (3.5e Prestige Class)

Ratings
== That's... Quite A Capstone You Have ==

Even for Wizard level, that thing reads off like a real Epic monster, and from what I can see, no limitations, you are just suddenly super strong. Heck, I'd commit suicide just for it. -- Eiji-kun 04:00, 26 January 2011 (UTC)


 * This class is a mashup of two from a weird project of Koumei's I'm going to put up here when I have the time: Dungeon Crusade. Summary: Warhammer 40k people land on a D&D world and then go to town. http://tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?t=49873&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0. But, yeah, that capstone is over-the-top. But fun, too. --Genowhirl 05:24, 26 January 2011 (UTC)


 * If it's too much, it should probably be changed. Surgo 06:58, 26 January 2011 (UTC)


 * But it have one Colossal drawback to... permanent Colossal size is a flaw in my mind... plus it is only if you are Reincarnated you come back in the body of
 * a Vengeance Titan Shell. + it only druids who can cast Reincarnate and getting a nature hippi to help a unatural robot girl... you get my meaning ++ Reincarnate can easy be countered so robogirl fall back to normal body Born to Be Wild 08:16, 26 January 2011 (UTC)


 * Just bringing this up again and once again expressing my displeasure of this class existing. It reads off like a manual on how to make a class overpowered and what to avoid.  But one thing is... Born to be Wild, what are you talking about?  Colossal is a HUGE boon, the LA value of a Colossal anything is through the roof!  There's a certain situation where colossal is bad, and this certainly isn't a hide and sneak based build, not to mention the stats, the special abilities... I can only assume you meant it in jest because I cannot take that seriously.  Plus to the saying that no druid would reincarnate her because she's a machine, well, Use Magic Device exists.


 * A bad bad bad class, and I want to take a chainsaw to it to make it at least playable. (EDIT: Winter Cleaning'd it. This needs attention called to it, its been nearly a year since creation after all.)-- Eiji-kun 02:08, 25 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Yeah, I think I'd have to disagree with that. This is wizard-level land. Until you get to Pun-Pun and some of the worse infinite loops, there isn't really "overpowered". I mean, even though it's pretty sweet, I'm willing to bet that a well built wizard (with incantatrix? initiate of the sevenfold veil? shadowcraft mage on top?) is a damn sight more powerful than this. Sure, it's pretty powerful, but the Mailman pumping out thousands of damage that can't really be resisted easily is more than a match for this. When put into perspective, at wizard-level this is just fine. --Ghostwheel 02:47, 26 February 2011 (UTC)


 * We probably shouldn't use Incantatrix or IotSV as our measuring stick. Just saying. Eiji, do as you will. Surgo 02:48, 26 February 2011 (UTC)


 * So... people are supposed to be scared by 40d6 damage at level 20, even as an AoE at wizard-level? That kind of damage is kinda laughably pathetic... --Ghostwheel 03:17, 26 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Eiji, can you give me the elevator pitch about what's wrong with this class? Colossal's not so bad -- the Soulborn gets it too. Surgo 03:27, 26 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Upon reviewing it myself, it seems okay with one glaring exception -- amplifier. That needs to go or be changed. Surgo 03:33, 26 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Already said this to you Ghost, this is mostly for others when I say that 40d6 at will to everyone is just one part of the pile of silly, and it's the sum of these already strong parts which makes it absurd. I do want to go on record as saying that Wizard level is more than just "stronger than Rogue", it has a limit as well.  I'm sure we all have different opinions of where that line is drawn, but the scale shouldn't be "anything stronger than rogue and weaker than Pun-Pun".  After a certain point, the game isn't even playable, and it comes down to who can't roll for initiative and say "I win" first, each and every battle, forever.


 * For the curious, my line is drawn at about Planar Shepard level, the shining example of abusive failure produced by WotC. That class already is unbalanced so I see no reason to try for above and beyond.


 * Anyway I'll come back to this later with a proposal of what high level wizard level adjustment I can make, yet keeping it in the realms of sanity.


 * (EDIT CONFLICT'D) Ooops.  Alright Surgo.  Now, this class comes to light at ECL 15, so this isn't pre-epic.  However the class gives several bonuses (including colossal) which are permanent and at will.  The reach and and strength, all and well, is very strong, but by itself it probably could pass mustard.  The blasts are pretty silly, but the high numbers by themselves isn't the big problem, you could compare it to disintegrate or something.  The AoE effect is beyond that, but we could say there's 9th level spells which deal that damage.  But it's also at will (and mind you I love the warlock and think it underpowered).  But unlike the warlock, who's dealing fireball damage to one person at will, this one is mass disintegrates at will.  That strains me...  Oh, and +28 AC bonus too total, which (mostly) stacks with everything else you had (the deflection bonus might not, but the natural armor bonus seems racial and certainly will).  Incidentally Ghost, for someone who holds the RNG as a golden law, that bit should worry you because if they were at RNG previous, they're well off the charts now.  They need to fight creatures far stronger than they were fighting previous simply to hit them reliably.


 * Now, some of these things might work alone but they just keep getting piled and piled on. I'm sure you can agree that these things add up, and adding up a bunch of things I think already are well over ECL 15 level, even for Wizard, is going to be greater than the pieces alone.  And to finalize, it's done sloppily.  Part of the power of Wizards isn't their huge numbers and stats and ability to break the system with absurd loops (which they can), but the fact they have an answer for everything.  If they were going for power it should be because they can deal with all likely outcomes competently, rather than having a bigger number.  Part of the reason they're dangerous is because no matter what happens, the wizard-level will be able to do something and be good at it.  This capstone does it alright, via nothing more than brute forcing it through superior numbers.  If I edit this later, at the very least I'd aim to make it less strong and more versatile, and ultimately it'll still win all the time, without looking like someone's homebrew class on Angelfire they made for their little brother.  -- Eiji-kun 03:52, 26 February 2011 (UTC)


 * (EDIT: Incidentally can anyone weigh in on me. I cannot figure out if Robot Girl is supposed to me immune to crits or not.  On one hand, Construct without the traits (though why not make it Augmented Subtype then?).  On the other hand, counts as Construct whenever it matters, which contradicts it.  I think they mean "for spells and magic" and not for things like immunities, sneak attack, etc, but it's not very clear.) -- Eiji-kun 03:57, 26 February 2011 (UTC)


 * The problems seem to be mostly with the vengeance titan shell -- everything before that seems alright (save what I noted). I think getting colossal is enough -- I dislike the number boosting. I feel okay with the wide-range disintegration because if you get rid of the part where you get extra standard actions, it's all you can do. With the extra standard actions though, that's pretty bad. Surgo 04:06, 26 February 2011 (UTC)

Categorization
Shouldn't this be a racial paragon path? --Havvy 01:27, 10 April 2011 (UTC)

IP 24.21.72.140
Though I am the first to say this class is garbage, I don't think replacing the entire class with the word "spam" is the right way to go about it. Since I saw no request for deletion from the author, I'm gonna assume you're vandalizing. Reply here if that isn't the case though. -- Eiji-kun 05:44, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

Your Regularly Scheduled Reminder
Just reinterating my negative opinion of this class again, mostly to see if views on it have been altered any over the course of time. IMO, this is still a blot of fail. -- Eiji-kun 02:59, 14 November 2011 (UTC)


 * I'm pretty sure Koumei doesn't look at this site much, and might not see your regularly scheduled reminder unless you go to The Den. --Foxwarrior 04:03, 14 November 2011 (UTC)


 * If she registered an email address, posting on her user talk page should email her. --Aarnott 14:26, 1 August 2012 (UTC)


 * You have to enable that Aarnott, it's not a default. Standard "big message across the wiki window that she has new messages" applies when she visits though - User talk:SisterAcacia - Tarkisflux Talk 15:36, 1 August 2012 (UTC)


 * As noted above, this was a string of classes for Dungeon Crusade, which used its own definition of balance ("Everyone constantly gets cool new things, shut up, I know this shit is bananas") and I gave permission to turn it into a Robot Girl prestige class. I am willing to go over both and adjust them, making the Robot Girl a little more acceptable to people (regarding laser vision) and making this less balls-out crazy. The Colossal thing would probably be the first to go, for instance - and for the record, you can't make someone Colossal without giving them +$TEXAS to Strength, Natural Armour etc. Otherwise being Colossal is what's known as a disadvantage. So if redone, there'll still be a variety of built-in options for overcoming obstacles and killing fools, but it won't be such a big deal. Does anyone even care any more? --SisterAcacia 13:31, 22 October 2012


 * (Watches intently) -- Eiji-kun (talk) 03:01, 22 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Okay then - started on it, with just a few changes. It's probably already 'just fine', by continuing Gadgeteer progression and gaining a bunch of close combat stuff, ray beams, magic item tricks and similar, but without extra actions and the Warhound Titan body capstone. Kind of tempted to remove some of the magic item/golem things and add in more "gimmick body" things like "photonic grav-field generators" (can interact with ghosts) and at high level a "back-up chip" (just needs spare bodies to make death less serious). --SisterAcacia 12:50, 23 October 2012


 * Well, tell me what you think. I consider it to now be much more reasonable for regular D&D (albeit D&D where we accept that robot girls are wandering around at all). Doesn't end up in a Warhammer 40,000 Apocalypse unit, doesn't get extra actions, but is a pretty capable combatant with a couple of handy gimmicks on the side. --SisterAcacia