Talk:Tome of Prowess (3.5e Sourcebook)/Characters in a Skilled Game

Open Submission Call
I'm getting to the editing, expanding, and cleaning up stage of this project, and wanted to solicit help to round a few things out. I'm specifically looking for help with feats and gear, though rewritten problematic spells and classes would also be appreciated. Anyone who feels like it is welcome to work some of these up, and anything that I like and think works well gets included here and you get contributor credit on the main page.

If you're interested, let me know. And if no one is, I'll get around to them when I do :-) - Tarkisflux Talk 18:14, 13 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Well, I think I could do some stuff. Just two things - it would be good to have some links to templates or whatever for your feats and stuff. I'd like to write some right now, but I'm having trouble finding exemplars. - MisterSinister 22:05, 27 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Template:ToP Skill will work to add the skill and relevant attribute to a class (though I can make it easier if that's desired), Template:ToP Skill Feat exists for skill feats and the [Prowess] type exists for non-scaling versions. Gear is pretty standard gear writeups. Any other examples of what you're looking for? - Tarkisflux Talk 23:30, 27 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Nope, that was all. - MisterSinister 23:41, 27 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Template:ToP Skills should make it easier to add them to classes now. - Tarkisflux Talk 01:17, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

This is Getting Legit
There are a decent number of ToP-abiding but not ToP-official classes and materials now. Perhaps enough to warrant a category and preloads for them? --DanielDraco (talk) 07:47, 29 October 2012 (UTC)


 * There is a category for it already, Category:Tome of Prowess (that hasn't been attached to classes for some reason...). Unless you want one for associated works that aren't listed in the sourcebook, and then something different would be good I guess.


 * What sort of preloads are you thinking? - Tarkisflux Talk 16:37, 29 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Didn't realize there was already a category for it -- I saw that the Tome Ranger lacked one and assumed there wasn't.


 * The preloads wouldn't be hugely different from the standard ones. They would simply include the explanatory sidebar, the skills template, an example ToP variant note, and the category at the bottom. It would make it a little easier than simply copying and pasting those elements from other ToP classes. --DanielDraco (talk) 19:16, 29 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Yeah, I sort of forgot about the Category outside of gear and feats. Oops. I'll see about doing the preloads in a while I suppose. - Tarkisflux Talk 00:54, 30 October 2012 (UTC)

Spider Climb
Does the Spider Climb spell need to be rewritten or does it work as is in a ToP game? --TheDarkWad (talk) 01:40, 6 November 2014 (UTC)


 * Spider climb is definitely better than the climb in athletics initially, but the intent was for magic to retain that sort of edge for two-ish levels (there are cases where that's not true, e.g. fly / air walk vs. balance, but those are mostly intended - I may have missed some that aren't). It's a spell that carries substantial opportunity cost if prepared when you first have access to it since it has limited combat applicability and you have pretty limited combat spells in the first place, and that compares okay against the less effective ToP ability. And as that opportunity cost goes down the ToP ability strength goes up, so the edge erodes with levels as it's intended to. At level 5, for example, you can afford to carry it around as a scroll or prepare it without sacrificing a top level combat effect but the guys with the skill get to take a run action with climb and roll twice-take better, which will likely average out to near a double move spider climb. I think the comparison works at 9 as well, but there's flight by then and the waters are very muddied.


 * So effect magnitude is in a good place for the levels where I think it most relevant. The duration might be a bit much, but even 30 minutes of guaranteed climbing progress when you get it doesn't solve a lot of potential 3rd level environmental challenges. And since flight happens so soon after and completely negates the need to use it (while also providing a more obvious combat effect) that it's already a very niche effect, I'm disinclined to change it.


 * tl; dr - I would say it does not need to be rewritten, but could be if you were going to push tactical flight back a spell level as part of other rewrites. - Tarkisflux Talk 03:53, 6 November 2014 (UTC)