Talk:Silver Elf (3.5e Race)

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Favored Class Issues[edit]

I had wanted to list the favored classes as including Soulbinder Shaman, Psion, Wizard and Mystwalker, but couldn't even get Wizard to work properly. If anyone knows a way around this, please let me know. And no, Mystwalker is not an existing class yet, but it's one I will make shortly.

Something something templates, I recall that breaking before. I'll see if I can find what controls that. -- Eiji-kun (talk) 01:44, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
Thank you, Eiji x.x That would be a great help.
About the race itself, what do you think? Other than that it's yet another in the endless hordes of elven subraces, that is. Zhenra-Khal (talk) 02:56, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
Had trouble finding how to fix it, I'll pass it on to someone who knows what they're doing.
Ah elves. Astral Elves, if anything. This is all well and good. It's LA 2, and has some surprisingly heavy penalties. That -4 Con is killer. I'm imagining these things as waif-like versions of the psychic children from Akira, but not so wrinkly. Which makes me wonder why they have powerful build. Everything about them screams "no muscle" or even slight build. That's weird. I dunno, I suppose it's because they straddle the line between small and medium. It's not really a bad thing, just very weird.
The native subtype actually isn't needed. Native goes on outsiders, because the outsider type typically comes with the clause that they are also extraplanar.
Besides those things, seems solid. Cordless is flavorful and I'd actually like to see more fluff above describing exactly why they are so astral flavored (while not inherently living there), or why they seem to be very dark adapted in the otherwise uniform empty astral plane.
I like the telekinesis, that's one of those spells that scale well. If it weren't for the ability scores I could almost say it's worth an LA 1, but the scores throw my sense of balance off a bit since +4/-4 can be hard to judge, especially on such a vital stat like Con.
Mull mull mulling... Gimme more fluff! You have my interest but I feel this is just an appetizer. -- Eiji-kun (talk) 03:08, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
Weeeeell the Powerful Build was because I was stuck between Medium + Slight Build or Small + Powerful build, so I just went with that one. The penalties were because i was looking for something to penalize them on to keep the LA relatively low? I had considered giving them some other SL/Su abilities (Healing or Faerie Fire) and/or Drow-Style SR, but I figured between Scorn Earth, Cordless and Telekinesis, they had enough going for them, so I was waiting on response from the community before I added anything else. The Telekinesis would let the character qualify for Master of the Unseen Hand at some point, which is as intended; I keep thinking about a Monk/Psychic Warrior/Tashalatora/Master of the Unseen Hand blender build with this, which will probably be something I make in the future.
As for the fluff, I'm going to add more, I just don't have the energy right this second. Native was intended (Dusklings from MoI are Fey [Native]); They are effectively Astral-Planetouched Elves who came from floating crystal cities in the Astral and really only took up arms when Githyanki start pestering them and trying to bully them around. I intend to release a new material, Astral Crysteel, that these guys tend to use for armor, weaponry and the like. The main population moved to the Material after a war with the Gith wiped out a lot of their numbers, leaving most of their larger cities captured and giving a sort of "avenge the homeland" character background that one often sees with dwarves and etc. I have a lot of directions to go with this, just... Not a lot of energy/ability to focus right now. Any suggestions are welcome; I plan to add in some various things with this, including new Ioun Stones, weapon/armor/shield crystals and a Psycrystal enhancement or three. (I really like Sulacu's Proteum to be honest.) Anyway. Thanks for trying to help, Plushie master~ Zhenra-Khal (talk) 03:45, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
Makes sense, makes sense. Also, I didn't know about the MoI Duskling thing, but now that I think about it, it does make sense. Not only is it not exclusive to outsiders (Elementals, and even some Aberrations sometimes have it) but it's saying "Fluff says Astral, but Material is A-OK too". Alright, puzzle solved, you're good.
I'll say one thing which you can figure out how to solve as you see fit. LA always comes with the problem of "squishy as hell" (and weaker in general) due to not having the HD for hp. And this is exacerbated by -4 Con. These guys need hps badly, or at least something which will help them ablate getting one-shot by any CR 3 encounter out there. What you choose is up to you: removing the Con penalty, giving bonus hp, DR, not dying immediately from hp loss, something... Hope that helps! -- Eiji-kun (talk) 04:32, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
"The penalties were because i was looking for something to penalize them on to keep the LA relatively low?" They have pathetic health, rendering the LA too high; perhaps giving them racial HD instead of LA could help close this gap a little. A level 3 human wizard with 16 CON will have 18 HP. A silver Elf wizard 1 with 12 con (16-racial penalty) would have 5 health. It's worse for the fighty classes; a level 3 human barb with 18 con has 37 health, a level 1 silver elf with 14 con has 14 health. That is, a starting silver elf barbarian in a worse tank than a human wizard of equivalent level who rolled/spent 2 fewer points on CON. Telekinesis is nice, but if they don't survive to use it, it doesn't matter. Fluffykittens (talk) 04:50, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
Okaaay. I see your point. I think something like Mind Over Matter, letting the character use their Intelligence mod for HP and Fort saves, would be applicable here. I do want to avoid racial HD though, as LA can be bought off, but HD can't.
After reviewing Dusklings, They're actually Extraplanar Fey, but you already pointed out that it's not just for Outsiders anyway. Moving on.
Due to their telekinetic nature, I had debated letting them be able to re-create the effects of the Shield spell as an immediate action as long as they have a hand free and have at least one Attack of Opportunity remaining, the shield lasting for the duration of your concentration, and maybe add some feats that improve this innate shield, but I dunno what exact direction to go in. Maybe being able to go into a meditative state that grants them DR and FH. I'll sleep on it.
"Okaaay. I see your point. I think something like Mind Over Matter, letting the character use their Intelligence mod for HP and Fort saves, would be applicable here. I do want to avoid racial HD though, as LA can be bought off, but HD can't." That creates a danger of making INT the "one stat to rule them all", for a wizard or other character who casts/relies on INT. Removing the Con penalty and giving them +10 HP and +1 enhancement bonus to all saves would balance it out a bit, but you could go more creative than that. Fluffykittens (talk) 08:35, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

(RESET INDENT) Oh, here's a possible idea. Give them a shield, as in the forcefield one. Have them count their LA to their shield. That way they are really weak, but they have a protective barrier of temp hp to keep them alive until they actually get some real hp. You can always break normal scaling and give them a set amount, or a set amount + low scaling for the shield's hp. -- Eiji-kun (talk) 08:59, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

"Protective Shield (Su): A silver elf psychically generates has a protective personal shield of force that absorbs 10+2/HD points of damage, has a hardness of 0, a deflection bonus of +1, and a recharge rate of 1/minute. The shield can absorb any damage except for poison, disease, and damage caused by natural processes (starvation, dehydration, etc), and does not confer immunity to critical hits." Fluffykittens (talk) 10:20, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
Ehhhh? Both of those are good ideas but I'm not sure just yet. I could give them a way to parry using telekinesis, being able to expend attacks of opportunity to make an attack roll (CL + Int) versus the enemy's attack roll. I do like the shield idea; I just wanted it to be something that could use as an immediate action in response to being attacked, and later while the shield is up they get DR/Cold Iron and ER.
That reminds me of the Orb items from Dungeons & Dragons Online, which were things you could equip in your offhand and when you blocked with them, you gained resistance to magic and energy (Blocking with a shield gave you DR/-), but that's item-reliant. I'll think on it.
A far as "The one stat to rule them all", Wizards and the like still have to worry about Dexterity for AC and the like, depending on the build. As I said, I'll look into it. Zhenra-Khal (talk) 16:29, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
Alright, I added in the shield after review; Tweaking it a bit. Then I realized I was giving a race with a Constitution-based favored class a -4 penalty to Con and switched the Str and Con racial mods. Which is still surprisingly bad because the class is essentially not-crappy Soulborn... Oh well. I hope to add in some feats for the race, namely those that give the shield Energy Resistance, DR X/Cold Iron, and let the elf use their Telekinesis to make touch attacks from a range, similar to Dragon Magazine's "Ring The Golden Bell" feat for monks. Zhenra-Khal (talk) 18:37, 6 October 2016 (UTC)

Template Issues[edit]

Fixed. Surprised "Wizard is broke" hadn't come up before... - Tarkisflux Talk 04:41, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

Thanks Tarkis! I recall it happening before, and then I think I forgot about it before it was fixed. That should solve it! -- Eiji-kun (talk) 05:35, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
Thanks guys, both of you~ Zhenra-Khal (talk) 07:24, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

HD can't be bought off[edit]

A comment on your reasoning. How about LA + 2 or 2 Fey HD, player's choice? Not all DMs are cool with LA buyoff, after all. --72.142.6.180 14:37, 21 December 2016 (MST)

I think it's fine as-is, mystery person. If you're asking out of interest for your own campaigns, it's easily houseruled. It is homebrew, after all. Just ask your DM, or if you are the DM, just arbitrarily decide which works best for you. I haven't seen any races that give a choice between HD and LA, so I have little interest in being the first. Zhenra-Khal (talk) 16:56, 22 December 2016 (MST)