Talk:Mystic Delver (3.5e Class)

Lost Class

Found it in my sandbox, it was pretty much finished. --Leziad (talk) 01:54, 26 August 2013 (UTC)

Cheat and Second Impression?

What are these? There are no links and I can't find them anywhere. Also, what spell lists does it draw from?

Cheat can be found in Book of Vile Darkness (for 3.0e) or I think Spell Compendium (for 3.5e). Second Impression is a skill trick in complete scoundrel. Finally they add any arcane spell to their repertoire and favorite spell list (which mean sorcerer/wizard, bard and wu jen), they can also add ranger to that list by taking a style. I hope I got all your questions cleared up. --Leziad (talk) 18:47, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Save DC

Shouldn't the save DCs for spells be 10 + 1/2 HD + Charisma bonus? It seems like a bit much for it to go up every level, which means that you're pretty much casting 9th level heightened spells all the time once you hit 9th level.

you are right, in fact it a typo I never noticed before. Thanks. --Leziad (talk) 01:28, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Do they get bonus spells based on Charisma?

they do, I shall specify later on. --Leziad (talk) 00:30, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

Delving Tricks Needing Some Clarification

Jinxing Delver says "The first creature that target in a round is automatically affected by an hinder effect with no save granted for 1 minute." Seems like a word is missing there, likely "you," but it's not entirely clear where that "you" should go, before or after "target(s)."

Stabbing Delver gives sneak attack based on your delving tricks, but then says that you can take it multiple times, increasing your effective rogue level by 2 each time. The ratio between Mystic Delver level (the basis for Delving Tricks) and Rogue can sort of be sussed out, but it's unclear, and this could probably use some clarification.

I love this class. It does nearly everything I want in a D&D character (if there were an ACF or a delving trick that gave invocations, it would literally be everything I ever want save for rare occasions where I have an urge to specifically play an artificer). Just needs a reread for some clarity issues. ValravenApocalypse (talk) 00:43, 27 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi! I'm glad you like my class. Now I have greatly improved over the course of 11 years, and my English (which isn't my first language) has definitely gotten better. Now I clarified the abilities that you have mentioned, additionally alongside fixing the mistakes that I could find, I also added a new delving trick, for you. Enjoy. --Leziad (talk) 21:12, 27 May 2024 (UTC)

I hope my DMs are ready for this being basically the only base class I ever use lol. Thank you!ValravenApocalypse (talk) 01:18, 28 May 2024 (UTC)

Repertoire Spells on Level Up

As it stands, the Mystic Delver only gets spells to her repertoire at first level. Is it the intent that they add more spells on level up like a wizard does? ValravenApocalypse (talk) 04:17, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

Only favored spells are added on level up. All other spells must be learnt as a wizard does (see the Repertoire feature). --The bluez in the dungeon (talk) 06:23, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

I get that. But wizards automatically gain spells in their book as they level up. I'm asking if the intention is that mystic delvers have to pay for every spell they add to their repertoire past those gained at first level, or if they should get spells to their repertoire at level up like wizards add to their spellbooks. ValravenApocalypse (talk) 07:01, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

Quoting the feature "Adding a spell to the repertoire is free unlike a spellbook, however the delver never adds spell to her repertoire by leveling (unless it is a favorite spell). She must find or purchase (or steal) any spell she wants to add to her repertoire (which might cost some dosh)". So yes, it's intentional that they don't get spells on level up, unless favorite. --The bluez in the dungeon (talk) 08:05, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

This is what I get for skimming and having ADHD. Thank you ValravenApocalypse (talk) 16:28, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

no problem! --

Um, is this balanced

Being able to pilfer wall knight and bard and other sub-9 arcane caster spells means they're not necessarily actually behind in sheer casting power, in exchange for all that versatility they get. And then they get almost as many invocations as a warlock? And then all the Styles other than Adept Spellweaver are so much worse than Adept Spellweaver it feels like you might have made a mistake. There's also the ambiguity about whether feats that give you spells known would give you favorite spells because those are the only spells you "know".

I guess aside from the balance problem, cluttering the class with bonus feats and trapfinding and whatnot makes it harder to see the important parts of the class, I've encountered several people who struggled to figure out how this class actually has two semi-independent casting mechanics going on. Maybe it's due for a rewrite from scratch? --Foxwarrior (talk) 23:03, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

It's worth noting that delving tricks cannot be taken more than once unless specified, so as written they can only get one invocation ever. (I do think that Devoted Delver, at least, should be selectable at least twice). Come to think of it, several of the Styles should probably be tricks (like whip fighter, alp conqueror, and learned professor) and several of the tricks should probably be styles (like invoking delver, maybe it gives Born Invoker, stabbing delver, and devoted delver, maybe giving two domains).ValravenApocalypse (talk) 07:01, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

Aha: Invoking Delver (Sp): You learn a single invocation from the warlock list with a listed spell level equal or less than the highest spell level you can cast. You may choose this delving tricks multiple times, choosing a different invocation every times. --Foxwarrior (talk) 21:10, 13 June 2024 (UTC)