Talk:Shocker Lizard, Paragon (3.5e Feat)

Problems

As Ganteka said on the race talk page, this feat has a bunch of problems. Let's start with the formal ones:

• This should be a [Racial] feat, not Archetype nor Monstrous.

• This should really be VH

• This should really be a paragon class, which would solve the problem that Ganteka mentioned: "Never use creature improvement HD increases stacked with PC levels".

• You said on the race article that you wished for shocker lizards to be more like those of 2e. Maybe they became Huge and gained a lot of limbs, but it really seems not in line with what shocker lizards are in 3.5e.

As for the substantial problems: giving that much size increase, 5 natural attacks on top of BAB attacks, on top of electrical powers, Improved Grab and Constrict seems a lot... really a lot.

I strongly suggest to make this into a racial paragon class... and then explain why small lizards become Huge eight-legged monstrosities with just a feat, no LA and a lot of other goodies. I'd say make a paragon class to give them some of their electrical powers and use a template for the increase in size or something. --The bluez in the dungeon (talk) 10:33, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Good points

I corrected it into a Racial Feat. Good call.

Improving to Large and Huge were definitely overboard for VH. I removed them and replaced them with prerequisite granting power. So they will still cost separate feats. That drastically reduces the oomph. I was considering splitting the size changes out to different feats but didn't imagine of a good way to do so. Now I think I have it.

The extra natural attacks are definitely nice in certain builds, but come on line at a pace that it isn't absurd. The lightning attacks are there just to transition from Shocker Lizard to Behir and are pretty weak for their level. I think this earns High power ranking now with the multiple nerfs. --ErikOfWiki (talk) 18 June 2022 (UTC)

It's certaintly better, though I would have chosen another way to obtain these benefits, like a paragon class or template, but it's not like there aren't some comparable articles on the wiki, albeit older. Gonna comment on the race too. --The bluez in the dungeon (talk) 07:49, 20 June 2022 (UTC)