User talk:Stryker/Dawnstalker

Comments

Firstly, I'm partial to ranger-like classes so I'm liking this one since that's how I view it (also as part assassin, which is reflected in my critique). If you think of differently, that's fine, but keep that in mind if you decide to make edits.

• First, the damage seems low even for a rogue-level class. Even with the up to +5 bonus on attack rolls (which is significant in itself) and the typical approach by most design philosohies that I have seen that ranged characters deal less damage to compensate for their relative safety, the damage needs to be upped somehow or it falls behind at high levels. For starters, removing the basis of Sneak Attack would be helpful. Lots of things are immune to Sneak Attack, and the rogue tpyically gets around that with Use Magic Device (something that is most of what makes it Rogue-level and is also something this class lacks). My next suggestion is to move each improvement on the number of arrows fired to a level where he gains an extra iterative attack (2 at 6th, 3 at 11th, and 4 at 16th, basically allowing a full attack as a standard action). Even with that, a straight-up damage increase would hardly be out of the question, as would an increased range for Precise Aim. More possibilities are listed on the bit about options later.
• This could use more of a stealthy theme than it has. Regular HiPS is perfectly fair at level 8 for a rogue-level class. Perhaps making a successful Hide check treat you as invisible would be appropriate as well. Even though it's a direct rip from Tome Assassin, constant nondetection is practically essential for anything stealthy.
• Just as a more thematical bit, Uncanny Dodge and Evasion don't really seem to fit for a class that's actually supposed to be stealthy. That said, the game rarely works in favor of the stealthy people due to the pervasiveness of detections like true seeing or even see invisibility, so they might still be all right.
• Options are exceptionally good in D&D, but this class doesn't really have any. Some suggestions include allowing the dawnstalker to make one shot with precise aim as a full-round action that deals a lot more damage than normal. Another would be allowing you to trade precise aim attack bonuses for more damage or vice versa. You could also trade them for status effects or other stuff as you see fit. All of these would maintain the idea of "I'm an archer and I shoot stuff" while not limiting your only option to "I shoot for some damage".

In conclusion, I would call this class fighter-level as written. It's sort of like a watered-down Tome Assassin (which a a pretty extreme version of high-Rogue level, in my opinion, but still within the range). Hope this helps. - TG Cid 03:01, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

Thankyou for the input i'm glad someones actually looking over this, and now I will try to clarify some points

• Yeah most of what you said here is what I had already thought, as orignally Precise Aim was in d8s and not d6s, but someone I know was concerned with power early in the game, I had forgot to put the extra Precise Aim shots on the right levels, increase in range I had not thought was necessary as 60 feet seemed quite good to me, Sneak Attack requirements was because you are pretty much aiming for a critical location (though when I think about it I suppose it says you aim for "a single precisely aimed attack" so it could work)and undead, constructs and whatever else can't be affected by criticals anyway, though maybe an ability at later levels which lets you do that would be okay.
• The stealthy part could be played up a bit more and if you could help with that it would be great, so I might move HiPS down to 8th level.
• The Evasion and Uncanny Dodge are there as extra defenses, though mostly because when I had first though of the idea for this class it was named Combat Scout, hence the Fast Movement as well.
• The reason for almost completely damage is that the way I usually play my DM makes damage the most viable way out, as I have been foiled in my attempts to control the battlefield and debuff a couple of times, (goddamn goblins making there goddamn saves against my Color Spray *shakes fist*) though if you could help with that it would be great, but then options for an archer would maybe make it a bit more like the GW's Sharpshooter, but hey I have some ideas (Like make him stun instead of extra damage except the damage die rolls become the DC for Fort save plus your Dex mod or something).

Again thanks for the input and i'd say that this is low Rogue-level personally or on the high-end of Fighter, but balance points aren't my strongest point (I don't have many of those DnD-wise :( ). I have given requests to others to have a look so hopefully this gets better with help (and I would give full credit if there was help).--Stryker 12:04, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

Well, the Sharpshooter does do a nice job with giving options, which is a pretty good thing to emulate. Like it does, you could give some damage and additional effects with a class level-dependent save so that you don't make saves ungodly high by increasing the damage dealt. In my opinion, that would be best because it allows you to both increase the damage and offer those saves. Something like Ghost's called shots could be a very efficient way to grant options as you level; in order to make them work with Precise Aim, you would probably intentionally reduce the bonus damage dealt on those attacks.

Speaking of bonus damage, I think this could be bumped to +1d6 per two levels (starting at 1d6/+0 at level 1) and the attack roll bonus start at +0 and be constantly equal to one half the number of bonus damage dice. This would admittedly reduce the attack bonuses you would receive by one, but +5 is still a huge difference on the RNG. So at level 3, it would be +2d6/+1, +3d6/+1 at 5th, +4d6/+2 at 7th and so on. This assumes you want to start Precise Aim at level 1, something that might actually be valid to do given the low damage of ranged characters but isn't totally necessary especially in a rogue-level game. If you wish, you could move the beginning of the Precise Aim Progression to level 2 and go by odd levels.

For stealth, HiPS is the major thing that you need to give, and we've already covered it. Other than that, as I mentioned before nondetection is an essential thing for stealthy people especially if casters are in the game (you don't want enemies to scry you out of hiding and kill you without you even knowing). That's all I can think of at the moment; more suggestions may be posted as they come up, but Rogue-level reference material can probably help you more than I can. - TG Cid 16:54, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

Hmm interesting, well my internet is capped (Mostly by me :) so I kinda got kicked off :( ) for awhile but when it's back to full strength I will start implementing changes.--Stryker 03:09, 17 November 2010 (UTC)