Talk:Races of War (3.5e Sourcebook)

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Jotas Pics[edit]

Okay, love the pictures, they are epic, and lovely. I simply think they may be a tad to large...

For example, my computer screen isn't near as big as these monsters. Now then, a person could argue that they'd be fine, and that the page doesn't need to look good on every screen, but my computer screen resolution is about average size (1280 x 800). Perhaps they could be better placed, say, at the end of a subarticle of the sourcebook, since they look awesome, but, would stretch out the text of the book otherwise, making it irritating to read/look at. Though, these could be resized and kept where they are. Of course, that'd make mine superfluos, and would prolly make mine need to be removed. Also, while the second pic is an excellent image of a fantasy warscene, I would recommend the first one be used, since it both exemplifies the aim of the Tomes to make awesome characters awesome, and of this book to focus on war. → Rith (talk) 03:51, September 12, 2009 (UTC)

My bad. On my computer they are sized just big enough to fill all the blank space to the right of the index. Feel free to adjust as is more universally appropriate. -- Jota 04:03, September 12, 2009 (UTC)
kk, fixed that, thing I managed to get a better size for all screen resolutions that still catches a good bit of the detail. Also took of my mock book cover pic since it does really seem superflous now, what with the epic pics that sit on this page. Put some space between them as well, to make the page not feel cluttered (fung-shua). → Rith (talk) 04:39, September 12, 2009 (UTC)

Unfinished armors[edit]

In the Armor section, many of the light armor bonuses are unlisted or unfinished.

We know. No one's ever gotten around to making stuff awesome enough to flesh them out. Feel free to give it a shot. --Genowhirl 17:42, October 19, 2009 (UTC)
Actually, someone has. You can find updated versions of all the Frank and K stuff (Races of War, Tome of Fiends, etc), plus some community-made material compiled into PDFs here: --Neofenrir 18:38, October 19, 2009 (UTC)
Holy shit. That's what I get for not checking the PDF thread on the den... --Genowhirl 18:41, October 19, 2009 (UTC)


RatedFavor.png Downzorz favors this article and rated it 4 of 4!
Even though some of the stuff doesn't fit my playstyle, this is a brilliant piece of work. Advanced Combat and Equipment sections especially. One of my favorite sourcebooks ever.
RatedLike.png DanielDraco likes this article and rated it 3 of 4.
Like most of F&K's material, this is a mixed bag of brilliance and mediocrity. On the one hand, they pull melee classes up to the VH level, and that's a good thing because it had never really been done before. On the other hand, they complicate equipment that did not need to be more complicated, and the abilities they write are peppered with not-very-well-thought-out consequences and ham-handed hard counters. Portions of this book are excellent, but I would not call the book as a whole CommFave material.
RatedFavor.png Undead Knave favors this article and rated it 4 of 4!
This was the first Tome I read, and it's probably my second favorite after only Dungeonomicon. I reread it occasionally.

RatedFavor.png Surgo favors this article and rated it 4 of 4!
A more controversial work than the earlier three. Turns fightin' mans into viable characters.

Rithaniel likes this article and rated it 3 of 4.
Block Reason: This is a legacy rating from before our current ratings scale. While the reasons should be valid, it is not counted in the ratings on the article page because of the inaccurate scale.
This sourcebook offers a plethora of fantastic options and insightful variant rules to the game of D&D, including a new system of feats inspired by the fantastic lacking of the original system, the revolutionary concept of 'the edge', and several peices of armor and small bits that make high BAB actually have value. This sourcebook offers a great patch on 3.5e, and allows melee characters to have nice things, and compete with wizards at every level in the game. Not to mention that the text of the book itself is insightful to the game, almost more than other F&K books already are. Now, this sourcebook, as a whole, would earn an excellent, but this copy of it is unfinished, so, the article itself, can only be given a 'good'

RatedLike.png Tarkisflux likes this article and rated it 3 of 4.
This is a great sourcebook, but probably my least favorite of the series. The revised monster PC rules, combat system, leadership rules, and other stuff is generally well thought out and fantastic. The writing remains amusing, insightful, and thought provoking. The classes remain good, but begin to powercreep a bit from previous works . Scaling feats are a mixed bag from a great idea that get a bit unwieldy for my tastes at higher levels, though most are awesome in small doses. The scaling armor bit has never worked for me. These minor issues don't strongly detract from the otherwise good work though.

RatedFavor.png TK-Squared favors this article and rated it 4 of 4!
Fighters are sometimes, just sometimes, allowed nice things. This may be understandably seen as a bad thing by people who have been playing with the mentality that there should be some kind of power gap between Fighters and Wizards, but Races of War goes to lengths to make up for the poor rap that Fighters have been getting. The handbook impresses me, the writing is masterfully done and the content is a good revision for certain people; like myself.

There may be powercreep, the Fighter may have an ability that's like "dude, wtf, sand in my eyes", there may be small problems here and there, but perfection is not what we're looking for in these kinds of things. This entire handbook fills out to be something fun and exciting to play. Not just because you can fluff up what you're doing, but because you're actually doing something and contributing.

RatedFavor.png Wildmage favors this article and rated it 4 of 4!
A work most exelent, love for the hitters

RatedFavor.png ThunderGod Cid favors this article and rated it 4 of 4!
This article deserves to be a Community Favorite, without a doubt. I consider it one of the more defining works of homebrew D&D ever published and also my favorite of the Tome books. As with most of the Tome series, I think a reader can appreciate it even if they don't necessarily agree with all the principles presented within (like the power-creep associated with its base classes, some problematic base feats, armor rules, and what have you). It's a great read with lots of interesting rules and badass options.

Bad Link[edit]

samurai has the level 7 iaijutsu tome when the character has the "edge" he may make an attack of opportunity. Clicking on the highlighted blue link it brings me here that does nothing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talkcontribs) at

You'll want to go Races of War (3.5e Sourcebook)/Advanced Combat#Base Attack Bonus and Combat Maneuvers for info on The Edge. Will fix link in class. Thanks for pointing that out. --Ganteka Future 06:28, July 11, 2010 (UTC)

BAB is underpowered? I thought so too... until I made a spreadsheet and did the math. BAB is *phenomenally* powerful! A fighter easily smokes a rogue of equal level. (Typically does 3x the dmg per round, or 1.5x if the rogue gets sneak attacks off every successful attack, which would be difficult.) Likewise, the cleric gets owned about equally, until they get access to Divine Power, at which point (while it lasts) they have the BAB of a fighter, and thus ARE a fighter, but on steroids. I've not done the math vs. a mage or druid; it's entirely possible they could beat the fighter with a save-or-die spell, but hardly certain. (Fly + protection vs. missiles could be a tough combo though!)

I think one of the major points of this sourcebook is that BAB is meaningful, but not by itself. It's not that significant when you don't have the damage to actually do anything with that BAB, which fighters tend not to unless they are heavily optimized for Power Attack and the like. And given the power level that Tome classes were designed for, when the rogue has access to Use Magic Device in order to Sneak Attack anything and is chucking acid flasks for ranged touch attacks AND is using the ambiguous wording of the SRD Rogue to get the Perfect Two-Weapon Fighting feat without meeting prerequisites, the melee classes need more of a boost than just BAB. - TG Cid 16:37, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

Army Size[edit]

im confused with the leadership feats. quite a few of them say you get an army of followers, but dont state how big an "army" is, am i missing something - Dr.Drako20:22, 12 september 2018

Welcome to Frank & K, masters of the vague. Unfortunately, they did not elaborate before their collaboration broke up. -- Eiji-kun (talk) 18:52, 12 September 2018 (MDT)
just say its 10 times bigger? -- Dr.Drako
also, what is a cr of 2 1/2? Dr.Drako 2:08, 22 november 2018
It seems to be a CR between 2 and 3. While fractional CRs are a thing, I don't see why they bothered to be that granular. -- Eiji-kun (talk) 00:30, 22 November 2018 (MST)
is there a monster between CR 1 and 2, or even 2 and 3? no matter how much i've looked i've never seen references to monsters with fractional CRs greater than 1 Dr.Drako (talk) 11:51, 17 December 2018 (MST)
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